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Author Topic: UNI Games Tiering debate  (Read 59780 times)
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
JMc
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« Reply #75 on: August 07, 2007, 09:37:20 AM »

Chris Freise and I have just started chasing the top 10 finishers from last year, in the hope that if the top teams (the intended beneficiaries of the tiering system) express their dislike of the system, it won't go ahead.

7 of those unis have contacted at least AFDA and most have contacted their sports association as well (I got confirmation from Flinders and UTas here - Tania is working on contacting their sports people this week).
Mac has done the same, but their official stance is neutral.
Haven't heard from Newcastle or Adelaide yet.

Think the idea was to try to get this top group to write a joint letter, but not certain about that...
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mattdowle
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« Reply #76 on: August 07, 2007, 11:49:50 AM »

.
« Last Edit: August 07, 2007, 11:55:30 AM by mattdowle » Logged
ulty_arnie
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« Reply #77 on: August 07, 2007, 08:06:06 PM »

Very Informative Matt,  Wink

 Tongue
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Chris
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« Reply #78 on: August 09, 2007, 03:07:11 AM »

I agree with Matt:

.
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AlecD
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« Reply #79 on: August 17, 2007, 01:51:33 AM »

Got a response back from AUS via our sports centre that just outlined the proposed divisional structure (I'm sure plenty of peeps have seen it).

Some of the wording I find quite amusing:

•   Over time teams and universities will ensure they recruit the best players to maintain their status as division 1.

Just how much are AUS rating the importance of university sport in Australia? Sure, it's provided the leg up/exposure for plenty of top quality sportspeople but it's not like we're in the US or Canada with big scholarships offered for high quality athletes to attend certain colleges etc. as a stepping stone to their professional career. I'm sure university sports managers and teams are working hard enough providing opportunities for students to play sport (which is what I thought uni sport was about), let alone go out 'recruiting' the best players to come to uni so that they can represent in some sport.

And all the while AUS just keep putting up the barriers to getting kids out on the field. I'm not even going to start whinging about the cost and AUS' apparent lack of streamlining/adjustment post VSU (i.e. compared to the processes student unions etc went through) - yet AUS proceed as before assuming they'll get the same participation despite lessened union backing/support of sports teams. Oops, just did.

Ramble end.

Alec
Flinders Uni
« Last Edit: August 17, 2007, 01:55:05 AM by AlecD » Logged
ulty_arnie
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« Reply #80 on: August 17, 2007, 02:38:46 AM »

You bring up a lot of good points Alec, most of which why I support Ultimate breaking off from AUS and AUG and creating its own University National Championships.
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littletom
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« Reply #81 on: August 17, 2007, 04:30:08 AM »

Has anyone else heard anything from AUS about what the hell is going to happen?

Yesterday I had a chat with one of our volleyball players and they said that their competition had special rules for eligibility for the top tier, like they required a certain amount of state level players on their team to be in the top tier. I am pointing this out to demonstrate that other sports have special arrangements, so why can't we?

*sigh* This is turning out like I was expecting...the debate or decision would be delayed and delayed and delayed until it was too late and this thing would justs happen without us having any control over it.

-Tom
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mike
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« Reply #82 on: August 17, 2007, 08:28:18 AM »

As rego's are due next Friday, i think it would be fair that they (AUS) release some sort of statement re: divisions before then.

I don't think it would affect Monash either way, but obviously as stated here we'd like the 1 division. What does everyone else think? Would it turn you off enough to not go?

Mikey
Monash
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simmo
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« Reply #83 on: August 17, 2007, 08:41:31 AM »

I don't think AUS will state before then if they are going to have the division split - we don't know for sure how many teams there will be until next Friday.

It'd be silly to think a team would pull out altogether if they aren't in Division 1.
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wetnose
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« Reply #84 on: August 26, 2007, 09:42:13 PM »

I got told yesterday that Pottsy has a meeting with AUS tomorrow (Tuesday 28 August) to discuss the issue so I'm sure we will have a clearer view after that.
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Jangles
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« Reply #85 on: August 28, 2007, 02:52:02 AM »

breaking news

Quote
Hi all,

I'm pleased to let you know that Andrew Olennick and I met with Tony
Jermyn and Paul Sutcliffe from AUS today and AUS have agreed to run with a
single division for ultimate frisbee at AUG 2007.

This was for the most part due to the number of formal complaints put
forward by the university clubs, so well done to those club executives
that went to the trouble of putting together a letter.

However, the university ultimate frisbee community should be aware that
(as far as I am aware):
1. all other team sports at AUG are operating under a divisional structure
2. AUS and the universities see this continuing for the indefinite future
3. the single division for ultimate frisbee is only for 2007, there are no
promises on what will occur in 2008

So, I strongly suggest that you keep in mind that final placings in 2007
could affect your qualification for 2008.

--
Jonathan Potts
AFDA CEO
0405 188 599
[email protected]
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wetnose
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« Reply #86 on: August 28, 2007, 02:56:55 AM »

THANK GOD FOR THAT!!! So much talk and worry all solved in a few lines from Pottsy. Thank god for Pottsy.
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Chris
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« Reply #87 on: October 02, 2007, 05:35:50 AM »

I don't know what anyone else thinks after playing 12 games this tournament, but I felt large percentage of them were a complete waste of time and in the end there were some obvious concerns about which teams made the quarter finals. Is this argument going to be revisisted for AUG 08? Or are future TDs going to address the concerns of excessive games and creating a fairer draw.

I personally wasn't really against tiering it begin with, but I guess the victory is soured a little if you know there are some genuine contenders in the bottom tier like there was this year with Monash and UNSW, but I seriously think that the running of the tournament needs to be reworked such that it doesn't require 10 games let alone 12 to get results.
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Tiger
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« Reply #88 on: October 02, 2007, 10:12:09 AM »

Speaking to a few people about it - I will be heading off to uni next year after all! - two divisions seems like it wouldn't be such a bad thing after all, though there were two points that got me thinking:

One division means that many aren't going to be getting a tangible reward, i.e. a placing finish.
Except, the way it sounds, everyone has a lot of fun drinking themselves to death and partying (not necessarily in that order) at AUG's so why does winning matter so much, especially to universities who, just out of virtue of not having enough high calibre players, were never going to win anyway? If a team is prepared to trek it out in this post-VSU world to obscure places like Queensland, spending a lot of money along the way, surely they'd know beforehand if they had a shot at the finals. And if they weren't in the same league as other contending teams then personally I don't think they have much of a right to complain that they're 'playing for nothing'. Nobody was forcing them, and they did get a tremendous party or two in.

Seeding.
Two divisions could work, I guess, but in my own personal opinion the seedings couldn't work on a year-to-year basis based on what everyone has already mentioned - awesome exchanger's (e.g. Mac's Julian) or people finishing degrees (to use the Mac example again, can anyone say that Mac won't be effected by Matt leaving halfway through the year?). I'm not sure if the general unresponsiveness of AUS this year in regards to whether AUG's 07 would be tiered is indicative of a greater trend of neglect to Ultimate (they keep turning the lights off at our hat league halfway through, is one example) but surely there'd be an efficient way to seed the teams not based on previous performances, more on how strong their current teams are looking.

Feel free to tell me to bugger off until I start my degree, just chipping in my two cents.

T.
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JdR
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« Reply #89 on: October 02, 2007, 06:33:16 PM »

Everyone agrees the draw this year wasn't a good one.

I think everyone also agrees you don't need tiering if you've got the draw right.  If you go with a draw that uses the first 1-2 days to generate top and bottom pools, then you're fine.  I'm sure this is what will be used in future.
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